When is a half not a equal half

[noryport]

Hi There.. can any-one out there settle an argument.
I stated to some fellow spotters in a lull in activity that the word Half does not
necessarily mean things do not have too be equal to be a half.

They disputed the fact vigorously to the point that the meaning of half was the word( equal).i,e..A piece of wood broken in two parts one 9 inches and the other 3 inches does not constitute two half's.
Yet the Oxford English states the some of the whole equals the parts it is broken into.Two halfs unequal in size there fore joined together make the whole sum. Does this make sense to any-one out there
and if so could they write back as there could be a Mc Donald's cappuccino and burger on this. JB thank-you in advance for replys..

[Mike]

Half means half to my wife - the wife gets half of my salary, I get the other 3%.

[noryport]

Cheers Mike for the reply.
It seems your wife's half is equal to mine in theory. ha,ha .. ..JB

[Paul Zietsman]

Mike,

You get 3%! I'd better get back to the negotiation table with my other "half".

[jakdaw]

In maths half is 1 divided by 2 so therefore equal parts, as 1/2 is also equal to 2/4, 4/8, 6/12s . Sorry.

[noryport]

Hi Paul and Jackdaw,

I appreciate both your reply's.
Paul I hope you had that important meeting How can you buy all that stuff for Christmas
jakdaw I see your point in your answer but my quest is for the search of something called the un-equal half.
Often we may share bread with some-one we know and split the bread in two.In doing so we may not be precise
in our action and the other person will say "yeh but your half is bigger than mine".

It is with this answer that I am trying to say yes we can have two halves but one might be larger than the other
and in so doing we get two halves but each not equal in size to the other.But when joined the sum of the two parts equals the whole.

Thank-you anyway but I'm afraid you have only half answered my question.

[jakdaw]

Yeah but saying "your half is bigger than mine" is usually used to mean "you are saying this is split equally between us (or in half) yet "your half" is bigger than mine". Similar to saying "that square looks crooked" if its crooked its not a square.

Half written as a number is 1 over 2 for a reason, something can (obviously) be split enevenly into two but thats why we have other fractions of one, to represent any other way of splitting something, for example 3/4 and 1/4 add up to one. But by definition half is always 1 divided (equally) by two or it is no longer half of something. Half a pound is always 50p, 25p wouldnt be an unequal half a pound it would a quarter of a pound. Someone may say give us half and the result wouldnt be exactly half and half but the meaning is to achieve perfect "half-dom".

So your half technically isnt bigger it should be your 251/500 is bigger than my 249/500!

[noryport]

Hi jackdaw,

Thank-you for taking the time in giving me your side of the story so far in the quest for my definition of an un-equal half.
In your case there will only be two halves that will always be equal and that's fine.I still believe there is such a thing
as an un-equal half of anything.

Naturally a square will always be a square which ever way you look at it or how you angle it.As with a tri-angle .
Yes the theory seems of 1 above 2 to hold but it states no where the 2 parts are equal.2 parts can mean they need not be the
same size to make the whole.Your sum added together will read 500 over a 1000 making the whole sum total.

I'll stick to my half and you keep your half.Till the twain meet cheers..JB

[jakdaw]

So you start a topic asking for someone to settle an argument. Then when someone explains the mathematical definition of a mathematical term you are still not happy. If a half isnt half its not a half (exactly like a square) not my OPINION, FACT. But I am not gonna bang my head against a brick wall, I am sure you are waiting for someone equally deluded/mistaken to tell you you are right, then will take that to your friend as proof. ANYTHING NOT EXACTLY DIVIDED BY TWO IS ANOTHER FRACTION OF THE WHOLE AND NO LONGER HALF. There is no helping some people, still merry Christmas.

[jakdaw]

Also am not going into the who/what and where of adding fractions, when you are struggling to grasp half as a fraction but the following should help

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numerator" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathematics" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Failing that the big building where kids go, sometimes do night classes.

[jakdaw]

Also, last one, squares and triangles are not the same

Square will always have 4 equal sides and 4 ninety degree corners

Triangles can be equilateral, isoceles or scalene

My point was anything off square is not a square, there is no such thing as an off triangle as anything with three sides is always a triangle.

phew

[noryport]

Hi jackdaw,

Thank-you for your last 3 posts.
I don't want you too bang your head too long it'll just get sore.
I am not making any beef about squares or tri-angles as you have chucked these both into
the equation. I stated that a square will always be a square and a triangle will always be a triangle
and didn't dispute the fact that one had more than one angle than the other.They are what they are
but I still believe there is some-one out there who might be a professor of mathematics who might prove or
disprove my theory that you can have an unequal half.

Not worth going to bits about it's just my point of view,
so don't bang your head any-more. It's a bit like saying men went to the moon and
some say they didn't. We don't really know but have to believe in the papers and the telly/books that
it is true.(I'm neutral on this point)I'm just stating this as an analogy to say we don't have to believe
everything we read or hear.All men are born equal but some more equal than others.You have 2 legs
but can you run the 4 minute mile.

Happy Christmas to you..

[jakdaw]

Its not like man on the moon, that is up for discussion and am a big believer in only believe what you are seeing.

But one day a mathematician split something into two equal parts and that process is half. the 1/2 number that represents half means 1 divided by two. If you divide 4 by 2 it will always be two not nearly two or two and a half just two. I am afraid that is the same with half.

Your argument is correct about two unequal parts can make a whole but these are not "unequal halves" but would be 3/4 & 1/4 or 5/8 & 3/8 for example. When adding fractions you add the top number but not the bottom so 5/8 + 3/8 =8/8 or 1 like 1/2 + 1/2=2/2 or 1.

So if not in exact halves, I would have a different fraction of your loaf 5/8 and you may have 3/8 neither of us has an unequal half. I can understand how the people "argued vigoursly" with you because they are right and you lack the ability to acknowledge that and thank them for correcting you. Do you also think that other numbers are wrong for example if you have slightly more than 1 does it become an unequal one. Half is a number, like 2 is always double 1, half is always 1 divided equally into two parts.

But I do love your persistance, with what is a lost cause. And all for coffee in a plastic cup and the bits of a cow no-one else would eat in what apparently they get away with passing off for a bread roll. Bless you X

Jakdaw (the 4 minute mile maths professor)

[noryport]

Perhaps my viewpoint might be now clouded by the numbers game.
I simply think(Perhaps lots of people think so as-well) that breaking a French stick stick of bread in two you then have two parts.
I then think I can term this as two halves or halfs. One being smaller and the other larger regardless of size I still see two halfs.

It's probably fruitless to keep putting up facts which might disprove my view and I think they are all
valid in the world of maths.But will firmly be convinced of all of these facts if you can prove your last words in
brackets from the last post. This is just my view point about not accepting things as they are presented.
The concise Oxford dictionary describes a half as being one of two equal or corresponding parts.So the corresponding part
could be the half that is smaller or larger and is so a part described as a half be it of equal size or not.From this I arrive at my point of
view that a half does not have too be equal.

Stephen fry might be the genius to settle this argument as the devil of this detail is in the English.
One man's meat is another man's poison.(The believe half of what you read and nowt of what you hear professor.. )

[jasonloibl]

Football is played in two halves but are not equal!
In mathematics it will always be equal.

[Mike]

I've spent all day in negotiations with the wife and I'm proud to say that she's now only getting
97.66666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666666(ish) % as her half of my salary now.

[noryport]

Hi Jason and Mike,

Thank-you for looking in and probably raising a smile at my fruitless search for the holy grail in this conversation,
Mike you are so fortunate you have come away with something.We have a joint working account for every day of life's little purchase's
and we own half each but what's mine is hers and what's hers is her own.

Jason that is a good way of putting things and maybe now due to this thread we should really say parts 1 and 2 for football.
Anyway I,m glad you could both come in part way of the thread and see the lighter side of it.
All the best from the sticks where being cranky is a way of life for half the population(But don't know for certain if it's the greater or lesser part).

Merry Christmas to one and all....

[Mike]

Merry Crimbles fella.

[vortex003]

Football is played in two halves but are not equal!

The intention at the start of the match is two halves of 45 mins each

The concise Oxford dictionary describes a half as being one of two equal or corresponding parts.So the corresponding part
could be the half that is smaller or larger and is so a part described as a half be it of equal size or not.From this I arrive at my point of
view that a half does not have too be equal.

My interpretation of 'one of two corresponding parts' would be for instance a nut and bolt set which are two 'halves' which when put together form one 'object' - ie one 'half' is no use without the other.

'one of two equal parts' is exactly that - two equal halves.

It depends on what context you use 'half'.You can't randomly break a breadstick and call the two pieces 'halves' unless they are equal halves.In my opinion anyway.

Merry Xmas to all

[noryport]

In a lot of cases the bolt is heavier and bigger than the nut that goes on to it..